Political Thread Discussion

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Rorie
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Political Thread Discussion

Post by Rorie » Sat May 13, 2017 4:18

This is a thread for political discussion, wherever it is U.S Republicans bashing Democrats, Americans taking out Australians, this is the place for it, but however let's keep it civil to avoid having this thread locked, keenmaster486 suggested I open this, so I am taking his/her advice so now that I set the Rules, Let us continue this discussion from the Ask An American thread but this thread is for politics, the reason I Started The Ask an Australian is also in reply to keenmaster486's thread
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Re: Political Thread Discussion

Post by ScarletFlame » Sat May 13, 2017 18:32

This can only end well.
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Levellass
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Re: Political Thread Discussion

Post by Levellass » Fri May 19, 2017 22:20

Ok, so how is it, on the right, that an alliance exists between business interests (Amoral, seeking maximum profit) and religion (Moral, seeking good over mere money)? In my country religion is roughly attached to the right, but not to the right wing party as its love of business tends to oppose moral concerns.
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Rorie
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Re: Political Thread Discussion

Post by Rorie » Sat May 20, 2017 1:04

My question is that if a nation like Indonesia (muslim majority) why does religion have to interfere in politics?, as of now there is a christian governor who was brought down by those who are against him, he is serving a prison sentence for a democratic right in many western nations which is to criticize religion (islam for example) all over some stupid verse in the koran stipulating that Muslims cannot vote for christian politicians, honestly back to my original question, religion should have nothing to do with who a person votes for, if there is a candidate who private citizens think can do a better job, shouldn't they be allowed to vote for them and to vote them out if they feel like there;s someone better?, much as I hate Tony Abbott The Australian Public felt that he could do better than Kevin Rudd and so he became the Prime Minister despite the fact he was fired 2 years later and replaced by Malcolm Turnbull and once again the Liberal Government is un-popular, the trend of revolving Prime Ministers will continue until the next election, till then it will be a race of politics and power until the Australian Public can vote again!
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Levellass
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Re: Political Thread Discussion

Post by Levellass » Sat May 27, 2017 7:07

The problem is that politics is, by and large, about beliefs. A lot of political ideology is not so much fact-based as ideals and evidence supporting a position is often highly partisan. Voters often base their vote, their idea of 'who can do better' on things like sex, race, religion and party. And religion, should the voter believe the candidate follows it,dictates a lot of a person's conduct as well as offering perspective on things like poverty of war.

In Indonesia the situation is a complex one. The governor was quite popular but facing criticism from opponents who claimed the Qur'an forbid voting for him. This is one of those 'pick and choose' cases where you can get any religious text to support any position you want. (Or just bull your way through it; 'the curse of Ham' as support for slavery in America was quite popular but barely biblical at all and heavily biased.)

But then he made the mistake of addressing this and what followed was sort of a Hillary Clinton-Deplorables moment where poor phrasing was taken and blown up into an election-defining issue. Immediately everything else was dropped for a saucy story on whether or not the guy had insulted the Qur'an, his attitudes and morals, coverups and assorted nonsense. What should have been a minor concern or trifling legality dominated the news cycle. Political opponents organized protests and bought legal charges and things spiraled on from there.

Basically politics used religion to beat someone over the head. I'm sure it's not relevant to any other countries or elections at all ever.
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Rorie
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Re: Political Thread Discussion

Post by Rorie » Sat Jul 15, 2017 5:27

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-07-14/s ... ip/8708606

How does a Australian Senator justify that he had no idea that he held dual citizenship for the last 9 years?, Scott Ludlam hid this dirty secret for all this time, he was well aware that he should have renounced his New Zealand Citizenship before entering the Australian Parliament, if he did this then he would not have breached section 44 of the Australian Constitution which clearly states
Any person who -

Is under any acknowledgement of allegiance, obedience, or adherence to a foreign power, or is a subject or a citizen or entitled to the rights or privileges of a subject or citizen of a foreign power
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Re: Political Thread Discussion

Post by Keening_Product » Sat Jul 15, 2017 11:12

Moved at a very young age and was naturalised. It's very easy to not have your citizenship papers - his parents probably destroyed the NZ passport when it expired, assuming he ever needed one.

It's certainly not unheard of, and the way the resignation went down showed there really wasn't a cover up.

Toby Abbott's dual citizenship, however...
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Re: Political Thread Discussion

Post by Levellass » Sat Jul 15, 2017 11:40

He abandoned our glorious motherland to wander in a hellscape of venomous kangaroos. He is either insane or a monster and should be taken out and shot.
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Rorie
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Re: Political Thread Discussion

Post by Rorie » Sat Jul 15, 2017 23:46

Keening_Product wrote:
Sat Jul 15, 2017 11:12
Moved at a very young age and was naturalised. It's very easy to not have your citizenship papers - his parents probably destroyed the NZ passport when it expired, assuming he ever needed one.

It's certainly not unheard of, and the was the resignation went down showed there really wasn't a cover up.

Toby Abbott's dual citizenship, however...
At least the former Senator did the right thing when he found out even if it was nearly a decade later!, however he could be made to pay back his entire salary, this could be the consequence of not renouncing his NZ citizenship when he took office, bob day and rod culleton didn't have to so hopefully Scotty is lucky, the finance minister will have to make that call if mr ludlam will have to repay back to the taxpayer

And about Tony Abbott, if he had nothing to hide there he would be truthful about his dual citizenship, that if he does hold two passports, he wouldn't answer questions during his time as PM and even if he is given a second shot of being PM which regardless of who is leader the Liberals are dusted. back to the dual citizenship, Phoney Tony is never honest so therefore he wouldn't answer questions or provide evidence that would implicate himself in anything even if he has breached section 44, if he has then it is only fair that he's repays all of money he has stolen from Australia!
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Rorie
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Re: Political Thread Discussion

Post by Rorie » Sat Jul 15, 2017 23:49

Levellass wrote:
Sat Jul 15, 2017 11:40
He abandoned our glorious motherland to wander in a hellscape of venomous kangaroos. He is either insane or a monster and should be taken out and shot.
There used to be a time when we treated New Zealanders like family in Oz, sadly those times have ended, you come over here and you have to wait an entire decade before you can apply for unemployment support, you may as well remain in NZ, where you are guaranteed the support when it is needed
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Re: Political Thread Discussion

Post by Levellass » Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:22

Rorie wrote:
Sat Jul 15, 2017 23:49
Levellass wrote:
Sat Jul 15, 2017 11:40
He abandoned our glorious motherland to wander in a hellscape of venomous kangaroos. He is either insane or a monster and should be taken out and shot.
There used to be a time when we treated New Zealanders like family in Oz, sadly those times have ended, you come over here and you have to wait an entire decade before you can apply for unemployment support, you may as well remain in NZ, where you are guaranteed the support when it is needed
I think that's the idea, certainly the policy isn't in place to ENCOURAGE us.
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Re: Political Thread Discussion

Post by Keening_Product » Mon Jul 17, 2017 3:06

Interesting somewhat related info: passports as we know them are a rather recent invention. http://www.bbc.com/news/business-40188997
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Rorie
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Re: Political Thread Discussion

Post by Rorie » Tue Jul 18, 2017 7:36

Just when you thought that was the end of it, another greens senator resigns over the dual citizenship bungle
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-07-18/l ... le/8720066
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Rorie
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Re: Political Thread Discussion

Post by Rorie » Tue Jul 18, 2017 7:42

Levellass wrote:
Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:22
Rorie wrote:
Sat Jul 15, 2017 23:49
Levellass wrote:
Sat Jul 15, 2017 11:40
He abandoned our glorious motherland to wander in a hellscape of venomous kangaroos. He is either insane or a monster and should be taken out and shot.
There used to be a time when we treated New Zealanders like family in Oz, sadly those times have ended, you come over here and you have to wait an entire decade before you can apply for unemployment support, you may as well remain in NZ, where you are guaranteed the support when it is needed
I think that's the idea, certainly the policy isn't in place to ENCOURAGE us.
True we started shortchanging you 2001, I think don't know I always thought we treated New Zealanders equally but apparently not, makes you wish you arrived in Australia before the discrimination started, it ain't like we cannot afford to, Australia is a lot more wealthier than NZ, So I don;t see why?
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Re: Political Thread Discussion

Post by Keening_Product » Tue Jul 18, 2017 17:47

Rorie wrote:
Tue Jul 18, 2017 7:36
Just when you thought that was the end of it, another greens senator resigns over the dual citizenship bungle
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-07-18/l ... le/8720066
A more applicable word would be "mistake." Very similar circumstances to Ludlam - moved at very young age, very honest and upfront about it on discovery.
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